Has anyone encountered problems printing with the White Resin?
we recently purchased a brand new resin tray and 2 bottles of white resin to use with our Form 1. Today we put the new tray in, filled the tank to the max line with the White Resin and did a test print of a simple box, the part came out warped. We passed this off as having something to do with the placement and the support layout so we tried another model, a few tiny vent hoods for an architectural model. They have all failed whereas when we used the Clear resin, everything turned out.
We’re using the exact same model, exact same Form file, exact same layout, exact same support structure, we made sure to select White Resin as 0.25 setting -as these are really tiny pieces. With these two instances of failed prints, we’re starting to wonder if it has something to do with the material characteristics of the White resin? We’ve noticed that the White resin is particularly lower in viscosity than the clear resin. Is this the case or did we perhaps get a bad batch?
Have you tried going back to the clear resin and vat with the clear resin? If yes, did the clear ones print correctly again? I do not think there are any real differences between the gray and white resin other then color and the clear I believe is the gray and white resin with out the pigment. FL had said something somewhere that says the white is formulated for a better feel but I have no idea where I saw that and if there really is a difference.
I am sure you have checked but I would double check to see the film that comes on the bottom of the vat is removed. Other then that, I would try to print the 5 butterflies in white and see how they come out.
Hi David, Thanks for your reply. We have tried the Clear resin again and the prints come out. For some reason the white resin does not print properly. Last night we tried repositioning the models in a different area and arrangement and even tried changing some of the support and orientation properties while still keeping our original layout and figures to print as comparison, again they failed. This is frustrating as we are on a project crunch. Not to mention the $400.00 we spent on 2 liters of White and express shipping. I’m starting to wonder if we received a bad batch? As I mentioned, the viscosity of the white is visibly lower than the Clear, the ‘dripping’ off the print table while printing is very noticeable compared to the clear which tends to stick more like a gooey liquid on the table and models.
BTW, I’ve heard from some other users that trying different settings such as using the grey setting ‘cures’ the resin a bit more. Is this true? Are there different intensities of curing for the different resins? When a clear print didn’t work out, we tried selecting grey as the medium and it seemed to have improved the model integrity slightly. Would this be a case in terms of the white? Thank you David.
It sounds like there is something up with the white resin or the vat you are using. Last I checked, all the resins (gray, clear, and white) are similar in viscosity. They may not be the exact same but similar. I have not used different color resin settings with different colors. Others have had better luck by doing this but my thought process with this is if I have to use a different setting there is a problem.
If you have not opened up a support ticket, I would.
Can you post some pictures of the various results? It may help seeing exactly how the vent hoods failed.
Hi David, please find some pictures and the Form file of the single vent hood. As you can see in the picture entitled “PART 1”, a successful print was accomplished using the Clear resin. In the other two photos show a series of these vent hood part -or more correctly- the supports of the vent hood parts with some other models unsuccessfully printed. Any ideas? Thank you!
It is strange that the raft and supports seemed to print just fine. I am going to print out a few (or at least try and I will let you know how I make out). I do not see why the raft and supports would print and then the model would not.
I have printed parts of this size with 1 and 2 supports so I am not sure what is going on.
It may be worth shelling the part even though there is not much to it.
When I took the white vat out of hiding i noticed that the white pigment that separated was a real pain to mix back into the resin. It had looked like a reverse clouding. It took a very long time of mixing/massaging the PDMS layer for everything to blend back in. I have let the gray sit much longer and it was not difficult to get all the gray pigment to blend back in. Maybe there is something very different with the white. Hopefully FL will chime in tomorrow and shed some light on this. I really need to get into the habit of taking pictures to better describe what I see.
Thank you for all your continued help. Do you suggest mixing up the White resin a bit? From what I understand and have read in the community forums, the color is just a pigment that is suspended in the base resin -of which the resin is the same formulation throughout the different colors. If this is true i.e. that the base resin is the same, mixing up the pigment -or not- shouldn’t affect the print itself, just the color no?
As I mentioned, the White resin appears to be of a much lower viscosity than the Clear. When printing and peeling with the White, the resin on the parts that are above the resin pool surface tend to ‘drip’ off much more easily and isn’t as gooey and clingy as the Clear Resin. Do you think I have a bad batch?
When I go to use resin that has been sitting, I massage the PDMS layer and am sure to mix up the resin. Before I add resin out of a bottle, I shake it up a bit. About what it would take to mix up the pulp in orange juice that has settled and then some more. Then after I pour resin into the vat I mix up the resin again. This leaves an excess of air bubbles. I usually let the resin sit for at least an hour (less when I am being inpatient or rushing which is a huge no no with this machine / technology in my opinion). After letting most of the air bubbles dissipate I start the print. If you do not mix up the pigment there may be a layer of pigment sitting on the PDMS layer. This can not be good for getting quality prints as the pigment will block the light from reaching the resin. For example, if I did not mix up the resin before I tried printing the parts for you, there is no way they would have printed. I could not see through the white to the mirror. I really should have taken a picture. I may let the vat sit for 2 weeks again just to show what happened.
It is possible the batch has an issue. Hopefully someone else that has resin from the same batch as you can chime in.
My LOT # on the bottle is: 20131125-01 I ordered my resin at the middle to end of December. It looks like your batch was just made last month.
Thank you for your continued efforts. It’s good to know that we’re not crazy here! We’re going to also run some more tests after printing our mission critical parts in Clear. Thank you!
After cleaning up the cured bits from my vat and trying again, failing, I repositioned and changed some of the support settings I was able to successfully print the parts in white.
I noticed that the density and touch point size you had at the lowest setting. I also noticed that the base thickness and height above base were not the defaults. Not saying changing any of these settings is bad (that is what they are there for in the first place) I used the default base thickness and the default height above base as a starting point.
I then took 5 copies of your model, centered them around the middle of the build platform. I left 1 with your orientation and density and touch point settings. The other 4 I adjusted at various orientations and support density settings. Since I had to wait ~2 hours to determine that the parts failed or nothing printed at all (the second failure) I decided to print the parts at .1mm They came out. Your orientation printed as I would have expected. The part looks right but the supports are a bit weak for the model size. The others I will need to let the part dry out before I can tell you more. I do think due to the part size you may want to chain some of them together (like you did in your picture of them in a row) and add supports. 2 seems to not be enough. I know it printed in clear. I can not answer why. I would take all the information you have and what I have seen and open a support ticket. They may be able to tell you more. Being that the parts are so small with very little detail I would try to print them at .1 or .05. Printing at .025 is over kill for little boxes. Just my opinion though.
Another option depending on how many of these you need, while you are on a time crunch, print 1 out with a sprue drawn on, make a mold and cast them. The part that will take the longest is waiting for the mold rubber to cure. It is not a fix for what you are experiencing but a way to ease the pain of poor results.
Here is a picture of the parts. I tried taking more but I really need to get a better camera. Anyway, if you try to reprint (I remember it worked in clear) try and orient the part with supports running up 2 edges. It will use up a little more resin, take marginally more time to print, and take an extra minute or 2 to remove the supports and clean up the nubs. MAYBE, you will have better results. I hope.
same here… I have problem with my white resin as well…
I noticed the viscosity of white resin is much lower than clear… I don’t have gray so no idea there…
The prints do come out… but the details are terrible… the details are not at all sharp and seems to be more over cured? small features are fused together… same prints from clear resin show much better results… even the printed supports looks worse than clear ones… not to mention the print it self…
And seems that there are more tiny flakes and jello come up around the print…
I tried all the white clear gray 0.05 settings… and non obvious improvement
I have the same problem. I had no trouble with the grey at all. I bought a new resin tank, 3 bottles of white and begun printing. NONE of my prints have come out or finished correctly. It seems (dont know why) that the resin either isnt curing or similar. Some prints fail within the first hour or as one I checked this morning, 3/4 of the way through. I am completely flustered with this and as Eric stated a rather expensive way to find errors!!! The white, to me, does not look ‘mixed’’ or have a consistent colour, it almost looks like the stuff has separated. I do mix it up by shaking the bottle for quite a while before filling the tank so its not me.
@Eric did you get some sort of resolution from Formlabs?
unfortunately, I’m still trying to resolve the issue with Formlabs. Meagan at Formlabs has been SUPER helpful in trying to help us figure this out (definite nod to her) but we are still experiencing problems with the white resin. Our new bottle seems to be more consistent throughout in terms of its viscosity and color however, prints are still failing. We’re getting misprinted parts, bubbling, etc. And we’ve exhausted our options in terms of orientation, resolutions, support placements and densities, etc. We’re stuck, and it now appears that the Clear Resin is also becoming problematic. I wonder if there is something failing within the Form 1 itself.
crikey mate thanks for the quick response!!! Mate Im no expert on anything but 30 years in the construction industry has taught me one thing, new stuff fails a LOT. It appears we have the same issues, I will post some images of mine when I get home from work. For me, by the looks of it, the print (inexplicably) fails to peel properly and the structure of the cured resin seems ‘gritty’. As I said, I mix mine with vigorous shaking (akin to aerosol paint prep) before I add it to the tank. Now I have noticed that its viscosity and colour seemed a lot better than the first effort, it still however had that photoshop ‘filter>clouds’ look to it. My main problem is I am trying to leave the construction industry, take on 3D printing as a business and have purchased the white resin on the suggestion of my brother in the USA (they like white models, go figure). I have spoken to him about it and I am about to lose a very large amount of work if I cant get this solved…kind of testicle shattering ride Im afraid and not in a good way. I havent replaced the old tank, I may do that tonight and try a reprint with the grey. I hate having to do this, as I am so damn far away I cant just pop down the road and get more resin.
Thanks again though Eric for your help, I will follow you and see where you end up, hopefully in a better situation.
Ok Eric, apologies was a big day building roads, I have not had time to get an image for you. My bottle does however have LOT : 20140211-01 if that is of any use. I will get back to you tomorrow, in the meantime I shall get a support ticket myself and try to either get the faulty (I believe) resin replaced or a resolution of some sort. For now I have replaced the new tank with the old one and will try a print tonight of the same model in grey and see what happens.
Well I eat my words, the grey model turned out with huge holes and flaws. Its either the model (which seems ok) or my friggin printer!!! As I live in Australia its a long bloody swim over there to get someone to have a look at it… It might not be the resin afterall mate. I will post images first thing in the morning.
