You live in Europe? Where If you don’t mind me asking. I grew up in Germany but have lived in the US for 23 years. I’ve been thinking about these problems many times - not only from a quality check point of view but also from a price point of view. All consumables, if shipped from the US must be insanely expensive (they are already just within the US), unless there are plants or offices in Europe making them. I know Formlabs has gone abroad but not if everything is in place there.
I personally don’t care much for “pro-plans” or similar offers, no matter what company offers them. They are essentially wasted money and almost a testimony to the product not being reliable. While the Form2 is pretty reliable a pro-plan is a clever way of telling people we’ll be here for you 24/7. I don’t know what is included in that plan but in reality you can fix the machine yourself, if fixing is necessary after warranty.
I’d rather have all the single parts available and if in need they can be ordered from formlabs. The machine is quite simple and well put together so this is the best option.
Let’s say you’re out of warranty and the laser, stepper motor(s), galvo-unit goes out. You’d have to pack up the machine and ship it to wherever Formlabs tells you to - you pay shipping (twice) you’ll pay labor and parts. And the machine is gone for an unknown time.
There are no Formlabs mechanics available these days who’d be sent out to your home and repair the machine - this should be part of a “pro-plan”, to give it some value, especially for people who do see value in such a plan.
I live in the Netherlands. Formlabs in Europe has Offices in Germany and UK, Stocking facility in the Netherlands and production/refurbishing facility in Hungary. Shipping to Netherlands is quick and cheap. Probably even cheaper than US. Unfortunately the same can’t be said about the prices for products, that sport higher price tags. I blame this on costs and taxes. Offices, customer care and shipping are truly amazing. The production part instead is what gives me some headaches. I had 3 printers sent to me in one month. Two were new and one refurbished. I didn’t check the first printer (new) as it had resin sensing problems that made it go back almost instantly. The second (refurbished) and the third (brand new), instead, both showed relevant dust on the mirrors inside upon inspection. Since dust inside was the reason for getting it replaced in the first place, I’m starting to think that all of the machines coming from that facility might undergo a process that leaves some dust residues inside during assembling. I had 100% of machines showing dust upon inspection of the internal components after all… I have to disagree with you about pro service plan in my case. It proved to be extremely reliable in just getting me back to printing as soon as possible, providing quick replacements and great service. I doubt that I would have had such a great experience dealing with so many assembling problems if I didn’t pay for the PSP. My only issue with this service is only that they don’t offer it for any longer than 12 months.
Upon further inspection under daylight, I immediately saw that other than dust on the main mirror, this new unit also has oily marks on the inside of the optical window. Having both printers here I put them on the same table and The refurbished one looks pristine, while the brand new that was just unpacked has this oily texture covering all of the inner face. Pics attached.
Unfortunately I updated the firmware on each and every printer as they all came with the same old firmware from april. The first one wouldnt work precisely on the latest firmware that supposedly fixed the problem. I know that some people for example could get away with the problem that you describe by slightly twisting the tray. In my case that didn’t work. Updating firmware also didn’t. Finally the customer service saw the diagnostics and immediately said it had to be replaced, no further investigation was necessary. This imo points towards a bad sensor way more than that common resin sensing error that is firmware related and is very often heard of. For the third printer they arranged to ship me a new optical window and a courtesy resin cartridge for the inconvenience. I will have to actually do the swap myself as my camera shop refused to service the printer. Being this the case I would gladly accept your offer of making the video, if you have some time for it, It would immensely help. The instructions I received are precise, but seeing how much you need to partially unscrew for example, and the whole exact procedure would be completely amazing to reduce potential problems…
Netherlands, okay, thanks for clarifying the situation over there.
Wow, that definitely is something I have not seen before either. Strange! Where is our quality check in Europe?
I am quite surprised how “freely” you are willing to pay for everything - this is not a matter of having money to throw away, this is a matter of principle. The machine is new and that’s what it should be…simple.
Of course you’ll disagree with me on that pro service plan or else you wouldn’t have bought it.
I had 2 machine failures when I was working with the Form 1+ machines - I still had warranty both times - customer service took care of me within a couple of days each time and sent a replacement machine - good customer service is a sign of a good company.
Especially having that pro plan, you would expect Formlabs to take care of your problem properly.
Just in case you’d like to become more self-efficient and end up wanting to dare the rather simple step of taking the glass off yourself, clean it put it back on and be back running within 20 minutes, let me know. I’ll make a short video on how to do it and send it to you.
One more thing - about your first machine that showed the “Resin Sensor Error” - that error actually was not a machine (technical) problem that was a software problem not Preform but the software on the machine’s system board, the firmware. That was fixed with the latest firmware update. So your 2 replacement machines of course came with the latest firmware, eliminating that error.
Thanks for the detailed answer. All of the three printers came with the same firmware from april, and all three were updated before use. This probably ecludes the firmware issue, as it was displaying the error on the latest firmware, exactly the one that was supposed to fix it. Also the customer service replaced it immediately after seeing diagnostics. So quick that I doubt it would be fixable with a simple software change. Regarding the window I would love to receive the video of you showing the exact procedure. The customer service arranged to ship me a replacement window and a courtesy cartridge as a compensation for the disservice. Since my camera shop refused to service the form2, I’ll have to do it myself and your tutorial would be of immense help. Thank you so much for offering!
I was reading through the instructions but I have a little bit of troubles understanding part 3
Basically here in the beginning it’s talking about 4 screws on the window. the left ones have to be loosened, the right side ones need to be removed. Until this point everything is ok. The next sentence, though, is referencing 6 (other??) screws. It says that they are all same size, it locates them on the printer (not on the window??) and then it just interrupts without telling you what you should do with these 6 screws. I quote here:
“STEP 3: LOOSEN OR REMOVE THE SCREWS
Slide the shuttle all the way to the left. Two screws on the left edge of the window will
be visible. Loosen them - complete removal is not necessary, as the window will slide
out from under them. Next, slide the shuttle all the way to the right. Completely remove
the two screws that appear.
There are two (2) on the back of the printer in the upper corners, and four (4) more
along the left and right bottom edge of the printer (2 on each side). All 6 screws are the
same size.”
I don’t know how to proceed neither how to interpret this sentence. Jens, right now the video that you were talking about (I Imagine its the one that those screenshots come from) would be of great help. I also asked support for better explanations, but I doubt that they will come in the form of a video.
