New digital forge 3d resin


#42

There’s been reports that the quality of FormLabs resin tank are dropping and causing leaks with third party resins.

The issue is caused with resin sitting in tanks for long periods of time and causing the PDMS layer to lift and leaking onto the printer. Does anyone know if this is happening with Digital Forge 3D resins?


#43

That sounds great, but! Over the past 2.5 years I have read many of these claims. It’s easy to make a resin that works for figurines and art models. But not so easy to make something crisp and dimensional accurate.

I’ve heard promising news from people using this resin in closed mode, but none of it was backed by data so far.

So that’s why I ask if there is any (independent) dimensional report and side-by-side comparison. I think you can gain a lot of industrial customers if you can make a similar datasheet to formlabs and back any claim with actual data.


#44

This is possible, but one thing I have noticed is Formlabs VATs change from time to time. I just got two VAT’s that are now causing the initial layers of uv cured resin to stick to just the center area of them on the first couple of layers. This did not happen on any older VATs I had around. Clearly these new trays are being moved before the silicone has set up completely, perhaps in a rush to complete the drying and produce more? Creating some high points in the tray.


#45

Never received the test resin from them. :pensive::cry:


#46

Those photos at the top of the thread appear to show thicker features on DF than FL resin prints.

Has anyone actually measured the output of both and compared?


#47

I think that’s V1 resin. They now have a V2 resin which over cures less.


#48

I noticed that this topic hasn’t gotten a lot of updates lately, so I guess I’ll throw my hat into the ring. I’ve just ordered a few bottles of the DF Gray to start out with, haven’t yet received them.

  • Has anyone had any luck with using/reusing an empty Formlabs cartridge with the DF Gray v2 so that the wiper and other features of the Form2 might work?
  • What settings did you use for the best results? (DF seems to be recommending White V1 on their website; not knowing the chemistry, I was surprised it wasn’t more similar to the FLGray.)
  • Did you start a brand-new tank for using with the DF Gray, or were you able to reuse a tank that you used clear/white/black Formlabs resin in previously?
  • Has using the DF Gray resin seemed to impact your tank life in any way, positive or negative?
  • Did your print success rate change in any way with the DF resin?
  • If you paint your output, did you find that they were being truthful that no primer is needed for the models? Any particular paints you’d recommend?

#49

I’ve had DF resin in a tank since Sept. of last year and haven’t seen any issues with the tank. I’ve run through almost a full litre of resin.


#50

The new version they’ve been shipping I find is actually easier on the VAT. Its more buttery if that makes sense. My VAT’s actually last longer.


#51

What profile do you use with this resin? What makes it twice as quick?

Blockquote
oberst3221Jan 30
Details as reported by other users are super tight at .1 micron layer: awesome… I did a side by side with Formlabs Grey: no need to wait 12 hours for the same detail taking just 6 hours on the .1 micron layer setting with DIGITAL FORGE. Great prints we are supper happy with V2.


#52

Hi everyone. This is a WARNING. I would be VERY careful about doing business with “Digital Forge” or “The Collectors Showcase”. I just e-mailed them with a few questions because I was interested in their product after reading about it here, and was brushed off.

The correspondence went as follows:

My first message:
"Hello,
I’ve been hearing some good things about your resins and as a maker of high-end movie prop replicas, I’m interested in maybe testing it. However, I have a couple concerns since any possible mishaps by 3rd party resins may invalidate the warranty of the Form 2 machine.

I was mainly wondering if you have done any extensive testing with your resin in Formlabs LT vats and how the PDMS may react over time to your product. (It’s well-known that resin causes the PDMS to come loose over time, risking resin spill into the printer.) Since reports are saying that your resin has a much stronger smell than FLs own, it sounds like you use more solvent, which might adversely affect the PDMS.

Also, you stated somewhere that you use a lot of ‘hardener’ in your resin. Since I make props that need to be handled and take some abuse, durability is a main concern. Do you have any data on the durability (impact strength and so on) of your resin, and have you made comparisons to the different options that Formlabs makes?

Finally, what’s the glass temp of your resin when cured? (i.e. will it be stable over time under what conditions?)"

The reply by their sales rep “Brian Levy”:
“Our resin has a bit of nylon additive that adds to the strength. The PDMS layer will last about 20-30 large builds and then you should re-pour a new PDMS yourself if you want to: use Sylgar, or just buy a new VAT. The material behaves the same as Formlabs Grey in regards to the PDMS same life span really. Its pretty cheap, I recommend just trying a liter yourself. Cheers!”

Note that he essentially ignored my questions (and perhaps misunderstood one of them), instead trying to get a sale out of it. My reply:
"Hi Brian and thanks for getting back to me.

In regards to the PDMS, I wasn’t actually referring to the burn-life wear of the PDMS (which, naturally, would conform to FL Grey standards if it uses the same setting) but the fact that resins stored in a VAT for lengths of time will cause the glue holding the PDMS in place to dissolve, leaking resin onto the glass underneath, as well as possibly into the machine itself. (This is regardless of how many prints have been done with the tray.) Formlabs’ resins can safely stay in a VAT for a couple months at least, but some 3rd party resins have been known to cause leaks in under 100 hours! So, since people are reporting that your resin has a much stronger odor than FL, as do all other 3rd party resins I’ve read about, (indicating stronger solvents) I was wondering if you had conducted any testing into how your product affects the glue holding the PDMS in place.

There were also the other questions I had about how strong the resin is in comparison with others, and information on stability over time and glass temp (important for storage and longevity of printed items).

I mean no disrespect, but none of my questions were in fact answered and without sufficient information, I don’t think I would be confident in subjecting my setup (which is currently stable) to experimentation that can lead to disastrous consequences if something goes wrong. Cheers"

Brian’s next reply:
"No problem, take care!"

Mr Levy simply ignored my questions and gave me that thinly veiled “F O”. I don’t feel I was discourteous towards him. So either they don’t know or don’t want to answer- both are rather alarming. Looking at their website, there is no readily available contact information- you need to go to the CS HQ website to find information. Also note there is NO safety or technical data sheets on the website for their chemical product. With that kind of attitude, it’s safe to assume that IF something goes wrong with their product, you would be left stranded.

Formlabs may be expensive with their consumables, but their reps have done a lot of legwork answering various questions I’ve had and not once have I been treated like my business was not wanted. And that’s why I’ll stick with their resin for now.

Just thought you all might like to know about this experience.


#53

based on what I read, it seems like the solution would be to change the tank more frequently than you would using FL resin?


#54

If the resin were indeed more volatile, then yes of course that’s the prudent thing to do. But how is the user base to know the needed frequency of those changes? (Formlabs at least give recommendations.) I dídn’t ask them for a solution, but information on their product. My point was the way DF3D acted when questions were politely asked.


#55

I agree those are concerns and would be equally wary of purchasing this resin (literally stumbled on this post last night) but would cut them a bit of slack simply cuz the “v2” of their resin just came out like a few weeks ago or something (based on the time the posts talking about it) and based on what was written here and I think there was one other thread talking about it I’d give it a shot. I guess another good thing is that they did offer a solution. :man_shrugging:

But yeah, glad to see you asking about that cuz I had no idea wtf PDMS was lol

You’re right, they should have that kind of info on hand but again literally their website is kinda busted, having to go on faith that what they say is true, they supposedly did a bunch of print tests with those tiki huts and if there was a problem I would also ASSUME they would give some warning to the user about using this resin from the v1 > v2.

So my take from this would be if I’m going to use their resin to make sure to use as much as I can meaning printing within something like 2-4 weeks if possible and when the cartridge is empty, clean out the left over resin from the tank itself so it doesn’t eat away at the adhesive (assuming you are going to buy the universal cartridge by protoART so that you can use closed mode).


#56

We use Formlabs Grey V4 setting. We’re doing just loads of model production right here in the USA with the Great Form2. Of course we absolutely cannot use the Formlabs material as we’d go broke :slight_smile: Just too expensive for production use Im afraid ( great resin by the way just too expensive ). We’re selling ALOT of the DFGREYV2: we take the negative trolling of this thread as a compliment for sure. We offer a return policy if the material doesn’t work for users,


#57

We are pumping out models with the DFGREYV2. Check out this Tiger tank: 60 sets 1/30th scale. Made in the USA! So cool. The DFGREYV2 working like an absolute champ! We’re so proud of our chemist, check out the detail, and strong too. And a little prop to FORMLABS: I’ve got a machine on year three still printing 20 hours a day like a champ. FORM2’s rock I gotta say.


#58

Those are amazing results and I hope to get the same level after my order arrives.

It sounds like you work for DF, yes?

If so would you be able to answer @JoatrashFX question about the PDMS on the resin tanks and some of the other questions asked about your product on this thread regarding DFGREYV2? That would greatly be appreciated. :smiley:


#59

In regards to the PDMS, I wasn’t actually referring to the burn-life wear of the PDMS (which, naturally, would conform to FL Grey standards if it uses the same setting) but the fact that resins stored in a VAT for lengths of time will cause the glue holding the PDMS in place to dissolve, leaking resin onto the glass underneath:
We don’t leave the material in the VAT for any length of time as the machines are working 20 hours a day. So that’s a tough question. We haven’t experienced any dissolving of the PDMS, not at all. The odor in V2 is virtually non-existent. V1 was quite smelly.
There were also the other questions I had about how strong the resin is in comparison with others:
There is a nylon additive my chemist reported adding to the formulation so the parts are beyond strong and have zero brittleness unlike Formlabs Grey. That being said they use a different formulation to ensure the straightness of parts or rather to limit warpage. Our resin has slightly poorer warpage properties. We overcome this by printing directly on the build plate. So there are tradeoffs.
and information on stability over time and glass temp (important for storage and longevity of printed items).
**We’ve seen no degrading in UV cured parts over time. But we do paint them.

**My apologies for not answering them at first we’re quite busy here.


#60

Thanks for your part answer to my question.
My question ("What profile do you use with this resin? What makes it twice as quick?) was with regards what you said (as quoted below)

oberst3221Jan 30
Details as reported by other users are super tight at .1 micron layer: awesome… I did a side by side with Formlabs Grey: no need to wait 12 hours for the same detail taking just 6 hours on the .1 micron layer setting with DIGITAL FORGE. Great prints we are supper happy with V2.

What you have said seems incredible, you are saying that in open mode using the Grey profile of formlabs your resin prints twice as fast as the formlabs resin. Wow thats incredible!! After all the resin profile sets the exposure times as it controls the laser power / speed of transit. I cant quite see that its going to be faster if you used the same profile for both the Formlabs material and the DF resin in open mode…

You later say:

DIGITAL FORGE V2 PRINTS FASTER THAN AN OTHER RESIN! One of the coolest things I’v noticed with the new DF V2 Grey is that if I print on .1 micron layer there are no build lines, no joke: none. Its the same as building on .05 micron layer. I’ve basically cut my print time in half! My most intricate parts can easily be built using .1 micron layer now. Awesome!

Somethings not quite right.

Where can you view an MSDS for the DF resin?


#61

Think what he is saying is they were building at .05 and now they were able to get good results at .1 layer thickness. So that would cut down the print time considerably.