Mine looked just like that and the support team said it was a bad laser. What I don’t understand is why the support team can’t show us what a proper focused laser looks like to compare our results to. I have had more failed prints that good ones, two machines total, and I about to send it all back. I need a solution to these issues, as I can’t even get one perfect print! There is always something going wrong.
Me too, I am at my wits end with FormLabs.
Josh, I know it’s disappointing that your printer has been having problems, but I want to assure you that our entire team is doing its best to take on such issues. I’m going to take a quick look at your ticket, and check why you haven’t had a response. Our email-based ticketing system sometimes misdirects messages in the ether.
At any rate, as many on this thread have noted, we’ve identified an issue in which some laser modules have not met our performance expectations, and we’ve been working with anyone affected to repair or replace their units. I know that there’s a lot of interest in a replaceable laser module, but at the moment, that’s simply not something that we’re set-up to do – every replaced printer goes through a series of tests to verify its calibration, and that’s not something that can take place in the field.
If you believe you’re having laser issues, or have any questions at all, – please, contact our support team at support@formlabs.com. They’re fantastic at what they do and they’ll find you a solution.
As for the laser test, there are many factors that can impact what the laser spot itself should look like. We do not consider the test as a sure sign of issues with your diode: light bleed around the spot you see may not be powerful enough to actually cure the resin around it. The laser test right now is mainly used as an initial gauge to test the optics of the machine and determine if there could be anything obstructing the optical path.
I don’t think I missed the WIndows command for this in the thread, so here it is for those that want to try the laser test in WIndows (blatantly stealing from Daniel Davis’ instructions for the Mac at the head of this thread):
- Remove the build platform and then the resin tray.
- Cut a piece of white paper the size of about 7 x 7 1/2 inches. Put it over the hole where the tray was. Close the lid.
- Open a Command Prompt. On Win7, click on the Start button, and type “cmd” in the “Search Files and Programs” field at the bottom of the Start menu
- In the open command prompt window (it will be a black background with grey text stating “C:” type the following command, INCLUDING the "'s:
“program files (x86)”\formlabs\preform\preform -diagnostic
- When you hit Enter/Return, PreForm will automatically open with an additional Diagnostic drop-down option in the menu bar. You can click “Apply” or Exit the Print Setup window.
- From the Diagnostic option in the menu bar, select “Laser Spot Test” and follow the instructions by covering the tank area with the piece of paper if you haven’t already done that and close the lid.
- The laser should turn on for about 10 seconds. Take a picture.
- After the test is complete, just turn the Form 1 off and on again to return to normal operation.
I am trying to make a print after not using my printer for about 2 months. I have started 4 times now and get NOTHING on the build platform. Just a glob of cured resin in the tank. I have a final try going now (after throwing away a bunch of resin, cleaning the tank, etc.). I am glad I found this thread, as I suspect I have a failed laser - it just isn’t acting right…
LOL, I thought I couldn’t count, but I see the numbering was off in the original post that I copied!
I’m curious Mike Phillips. Did you leave the tray in the printer with the resin still in it for those 2 months of not using it?
Yes, I did… Is that not good? The PDMS layer looks fine. Laser focus looks OK too, but how are people taking pictures with the cover open? In my case my Y galvo looks totally wacked out. It is travelling 2-3x as far as it is supposed to.
@mike; it’s no good testing with resin that’s been sitting for a while, as MD has highlighted many times over, pigments in non-clear resins will settle over the course of just hours and will cause problems if not stirred before every print.
As for your galvos being wacked out - well, I have covered faulty galvos and how to fix them many times - but you can start here: https://support.formlabs.com/entries/41140023-Swapping-out-a-bad-galvo-the-PhenixTech-PT-20K-is-a-drop-in-replacement-video-of-tuning
Kevin.
also taking pictures with cover open just needs a little magnet…
Regarding pigment settling. I have seen this and what is frustrating is that NO where does any documentation say to stir this up. Only in a message during some of my trouble shooting sessions, did someone say, you should stir that once and a while. Secondly, if the pigment settles in “hours” this could be why I have so many problems with large prints that last 30+ hours. They all seem to work fine for most of the print, then part way through they start to fall apart for no apparent reason. I am ditching the grey resin for clear and we will see how this goes before I give up.
I have only used clear so far, and I mix and oxygenate the PDMS layer before every print. Settling is not my issue, and printer is on the way back to Form1 now.
@Kevin I don’t suppose that you could feel or measure a noticeable difference in the temperature of the laser from when it worked correctly vs when it failed? I think this is a thermal failure. I expect that the silicon chip inside the thing was not epoxied correctly and is delaminating off the inside of it’s case. The bond wires would still hold it in place but the distance between the chip and the culminating lens would be wrong causing the sort of thing you are seeing. It is hard to know with out autopsy of the brass can which is something you really need special tools like wire EDM or laser to cut open.
@Jeff - I think different resins have different pigment settling times - FL white seems to be the worst. First time I used it, my PDMS clouded after only 3 short consecutive prints. Now I stir before each print and it seems to help. Grey is more forgiving in my experience, and of course as Mike points out Clear doesn’t have any pigment.
@Evan - unfortunately I wasn’t monitoring the laser before it failed, it was only after that I really started paying attention. You may well be right that temperature could be an issue causing failure.
However as I mentioned after my replacement arrived I did check the laser temperature by holding my finger on the brass can after an hour or so of running a print, and it only felt mildly warm - somewhere between 30 and 40 C I think. Note that I had already removed the label sticker around the brass casing as I was concerned it might be acting as a thermal insulator.
I agree that Formlabs should have been a bit more forthcoming with print preparation. Despite how they make it seems so easy to print, it’s far from a simpleton tool. This is not a click and print process, and I think none of the current 3D printers are. As far as I know, most 3D printers have a good amount of print prep. Cleaning the build platform is the most basic, even for printers that cost a few hundred k.
Coming from FDM printers, I can appreciate how build platform prep can make or break a print. It’s no different for the Form 1. In our case, the ‘grooming’ of the PDMS surface is just another step.
By the way, if you guys think the pigment sedimentation is bad with formlabs resin, wait till you see the maker juice resin. That stuff is so loaded with pigments, your 20 hour print job will turn start to turn clear half way thru. I think that is one of the reason why formlabs resin is so viscous.
Hey guys, how does this look like? is the laser okay?
Hi Marcus,
Unfortunately without the characteristic squared off shape seen in above examples it is difficult to identify laser failure since different cameras and lighting and even paper will make very different photos of the laser spot.
However it does seem as though all confirmed laser failures on the forums here (that I’ve seen) are aggressively progressive. So run a few more prints - and if your laser is failing - you should know for sure after maybe 1/2 to dozen hours worth of printing. Failures will get worse and worse until you get nothing but sludge in the resin tank and nothing adhering to the build platform - and at that point (or probably before) the laser spot test will show the characteristic squared off shape.
If your failures are not getting progressively worse - you probably have a different issue. For one thing that laser spot looks very off-centre, so I’m guessing you have an x-axis galvo issue. Are prints skewed (compressed) in the x-axis? maybe printing off the edge of the platform when printed close to the peel edge?
Kevin.
Thank you Kevin,
my prints are not going to be progressively worse but I will watch it further. The prints are sometimes good and sometimes not. After I changed the platform height 4mm lower at least all parts were printed! Before I did that it printed better on the side of the platform but I am not sure if this was the X-axis! possibly you can check this on the picture here. It never printed over the edge so far but I had compressed parts. I guess because it was stuck to the tank while printing. I am not sure what is meant by galvo issure maybe you can explain it more? But if so what can I do?
A galvo or galvanometer is this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Galvanometer. In the case of the Form1; instead of an ammeter dial, the galvo steers a small mirror that guides the laser beam. The form1 has two, once for the x-axis and one for the y-axis.
It sounds like you’re not someone who’s comfortable getting “under the hood” so to speak - so I would open a ticket with Formlabs support. I know their response times have suffered dramatically recently - but they’ll walk you through a set of tests designed to get to the bottom of your issue or issues.
I am getting additional material printing inexplicably. take a look at the photo I have attached. has anybody had similar misfortune? is this a result of back laser focus? I’ve had my machine 3-4 weeks, and i’ve done about 30 prints so far. too early for failure in my opinion.
thank you Kevin …whatever you mean with under the hood. I guess I will be able to find out whats meant. Its just that I am german. I am here because the support wasnt able to help me. I only know about the diagnostics from the forum but I am still waiting for another reply from the support since my ticket has been closed without a solution.