News about a new Fuse printer?

General Discussion
41

The Raise3D “roll out” build unit did have me think of possibly a “pull out” Hopper/Doser assembly on a next generation Fuse…or something like that… allowing an easier swap in materials for side projects.

I would like to be able to try and run TPU once in awhile for some components in our assemblies but I can’t justify an entire Fuse system for it… so would be nice to minimize the clean out time and mess to do so if possible.

Blowing out that hopper and doser is an ordeal… would be interesting to be able to swap that assembly, build chamber and then do a simple vacuuming out and wipe down of the inside of the Fuse before a swap.

Of course, you’d need another SIFT… and at that point what’s another Fuse I guess…

This technology needs to be able to come down in powder price and out of that Prototyping, Aerospace and Defense pricing of parts before anything else to make its production part running feasible for the general consumer products…and I’m hopeful someone will break the code on that soon.

The hardware does not need to evolve…the failure rate + upkeep can be offset by a drop in material costs…hopefully a little competition can help bring this down so we can leave this classic “HP printer ink” business model behind.

10kg bags of powder need to come down from $1,000 first and foremost.

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42

Ooo very cool. I saw this yesterday but didn’t realize they were an established SLS company. Any pricing info on that?

43

Although TPM3D has not released the official price yet, it says the CF200 alone will “less than” the Fuse 1+ 30W, which is around $25k. Both the CF200 and the PPS200 material unit, together will be around $40K, the company told All3DP.

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44

Ok so like $10k cheaper then Formlabs. Honestly not sure if that amount of savings is worth it if Formlabs generally provides better support…though this is an assumption…not familiar with tpm3d as a company and maybe their technology is more mature.

45

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Probably canada is a little far, but anyone from US can get the machine from them. FL hardware comes from china.. And TBH the support is only great in US and maybe EU. In Mexico we have only 2 resellers and they cannot solve complex problems locally.

My Fuse 1 has a low pressure issue 10% of recommended and the FL official response was that there was no solution :clown_face:

I was experiencing orange peel on fullbuilds from parts, and the FL official response was to put more new powder until it got resolved. They asked for a temp test, and everything was “ok” no bed tuning needed and no change at increasing or lowering it (tests were conducted)

It turns out some user had the answer and it was the definitive solution.

So when this machine is available, I’ll probably get it. I will get the same level of support I’m getting today but cheaper materials and bigger build volume definitely worth it.

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46

I started buying in 50kg lots, which brings the price down to $800 per 10kg. Still expensive but not as bad.

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47

Hello,

we checked out the RAISE at Formnext. The funny thing about the booth was that we were advised by a (former?) Formlabs sales manager… A cynic might suspect something amiss…

There are similarities, of course. But everything is a bit bigger, starting with the build volume. The handling with the build chamber on wheels is great. No more unplugging and replugging cables. External cooling is available if needed. The Sift is also larger and taller, and therefore more ergonomic, IMHO. There are a few nice, useful add-ons, such as an air gun and other accessories.

An open material license is also available; I think it was around €6,000, or you can buy 10kg cards for €120. If I remember correctly, they mentioned a price of €65 per kilogram for PA12.

A nice SLS 3D printing system. Especially if you’re familiar with handling a Fuse 1. As things stand, I would prefer the Raise to the Fuse. Purely based on the technical specifications, handling, and of course, the price…

But… first, Raise needs to deliver a few machines.

These should run for 1-2 years and mature at the customer’s site.

Then there’s the question of the software. Does the IdeaMaker run as well as PreForm, even if some people complain?

What I absolutely can’t get out of my head, though, is this (former?) Formlabs employee… in other words: in Germany we say : “nightingale i can hear you walking” maybe similar to: “I can tell which way the wind is blowing.”………

I also asked an employee at the Formlabs booth about the powder bag issue. There, too, the problem was more or less downplayed…

Regards

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48

Interesting - I’ll be curious to hear your feedback once that happens!

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49

There is obviously a large market for a smallish SLS system. It will be interesting to see how all these new offerings pan out with customers. I have no interest in seeking the greener grass, as the Fuse1 has been very good to me overall. Formlabs has earned my business. Next up for me is a Fuse1+ which will free up one of my Fuse1 printers for TPU.

50

Where are you located? I quoted 150 kg last year and the price given by the reseller was the same as if I buy 1 bag.

51

USA. Have you tried direct through formlabs or are you stuck with a reseller?

52

At Mexico, we are stuck with 2 resellers nationwide. 600 km one from each other. Powder costs 40% more than US, at almost $1400 USD per 10Kg bag tax included.

53

Hello,

At the moment, there’s no reason for us to switch. The Fuse1+ Sift+Blast is simply fantastic in its workflow, especially regarding the entire build chamber handling. Unpacking in the Sift and all powder handling—sifting, filling, and mixing—all in one machine. It’s easy to use and easy to learn. With the Blast and the polishing kit, you get outstanding results. Only the 10kg powder bags are a nuisance. Sintratec from Switzerland is no longer in business. Sinterit is still around, but neither offers the same workflow as Formlabs. A campaign from a Chinese manufacturer is currently running on Kickstarter; these were also featured at Formnext. https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/zh3d-sls1518/zongheng3d-cutting-edge-desktop-sls-3d-printer?ref=discovery&term=sls%203d%20&total_hits=5&category_id=331

We asked if they had already been acquired, like Micron… which they denied.

Greetings

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54

Wow that’s quite high. I suppose if I was in that situation I might seek the open material mode and research a 3rd party material with properties close to regular PA12. Is the high price mostly the result of local taxes or just reseller markup?

55

We have the OMM, but importing materials for “testing” is expensive and complex due to local regulations and for now is not viable in both financial and time.

About pricing due to my experience is both but mostly due to local taxes and import regulations that generates an important financial burden on everyone trying to do business out of this, i would love to hear from users globally about pricing differences.

56

This brand has been in the market for a while, not renowned probably unknown for many but just as TPM3D they produce and sell industrial SLS machines, I thik they even have metal machines.

Very interesting to see the blooming of SLS through chinese brands and offering powder in the very same containers users are asking for, this is probably the very same Pa12 from FL as well as other materials since they offer the exact same lineup as FL.

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57

Wow the technology they used and engineering foresight in putting their powder into those plastic jugs is absolutely amazing!!

Formlabs should take note!!

Haha

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58

hahaha. Good one. :rofl:

59

same supplier i bet, and Formlabs went with the cheapest packaging option.