I agree. If it’s such a great product why don’t they have data on their own testing plus they have had it out in the field at commercial sites. What’s their results on the trays.
Its hard in the UK to get to see a Form 3, I have had an invite to see it in operation at a two day event next week - the problem is that the fees are £800 (YES - EIGHT HUNDRED POUNDS)
Just also discovered that one of the Form 2 distributors had one (with people from Formlabs to demo it) for demo for just a day last week - yet they don’t have their own machine yet. They said they thought Formlabs had published the event… We never saw it anywhere…
Is there only one demo machine going around Europe? It does not generate confidence that it will actually ship in June in Europe
They shared the tour on twitter. They go round in Europe. I think they are in The Netherlands now(or already done?).
It’s a pity that for the Form 1 and Form 2 they were send out for testing(remember bunny’s teardown and review?) but this time we have to trust blindly that it is a great product in order to profit from the discount. I’m still a little hesitant buying the Form 3 looking back at how things went for the fuse 1. I think I’ll wait for the first user reviews and then decide.
I mean, that’s not a Formlabs event, they’re just at another event where there’s other stuff going on, can’t blame the pricing to attend on them
@David & @Walter
I’m guessing neither of you were early adopters when Formlabs was on Kickstarter. Those folks opted to back the company in the hopes of saving money for the Form1 when it went retail. One could argue they were given a loyalty discount, prior to seeing the product in the real world. Even more so since the company itself was also new.
In the present, the company isn’t new and the Form1 and Form2 have proven themselves time and time again.
I’m confident the same will be true of the Form3 that I’ve ordered the 3 and the 3L.
Formlabs could hardly be described as a start up company, my own thoughts are that it might be best for myself to wait until the printer has some real world use before buying. I don’t really want to pay for a unit that is not at the date of purchase finished. Yesterdays announcement regarding the resins showed that they still have a lot of configuration work to do. Already they have dropped ceramic resin from its material portfolio.
I do not have a twitter account and tend not to watch social media for product marketing, hence why the Formlabs “tour” that would have allowed me to see it in the UK (Free of charge) was missed. It also concerns me that I cant see it at the UK distributors yet.
I will not place an order for a new car that has not yet been finished in its production version and that I have not been able to see.
I have no doubt that the Autodesk event is worthwhile, the problem I have is that I can’t afford two days of time for the event. I certainty will not pay £800 to allow me to go and see the Form 3 and perhaps a few other things for a couple of hours.
The Formlabs ‘tour’ was at GoPrint3D in Ripon on 29th of May with a non-working Form3.
The same company will be at the Manufacturing & Supply Chain Expo, at the Ricoh Arena in Coventry on June 26th. Their advertising shows a Form3, so I would expect they will have one at that show.
Thanks for that - will try and find out if they are going to have a working one at Coventry - A pretty case is not going to inspire me to place an order!!
Formlabs has said NO UK Distributors have yet got a working printer that we can see, perhaps that will change shortly
It should be said there’s a rolling lead time, rather than static. We expect anyone who ordered a printer around the time of launch(April 2nd) to receive their printers in the next couple weeks.
The lead time being extended to September is only for printers ordered today or later, rather than all printers that have been ordered so far.
Well, then I owe you guys an apology and am going to go correct the record everywhere on social media I’ve been.
Not a problem at all! Glad I was able to clear up the confusion.
Are there now any Form 3 printers available at the UK distributors so that we can see a demo now, or will they be supplied only when Formlabs ship to everyone?
Personally I have preordered Start of May, and according to the schedule I will be hopefully getting it in the next 2-4 weeks my guess until the middle of July. So I wouldn’t expect any serious F3 reviews from users before August or even September, as you have to use a product for at least a month to get an idea of it.
Myself I have been a power user of F2 for Dentistry-Orthodontics for almost 2 years, and I am confident that at least surface finish wise and perhaps a bit speed wise, the F3 will be an update for my workflow. In addition if the printer has as advertised, parts that can be replaced by the user easily (compared to F2) when something fails, that will be a major update as well for those using heavily the printer (professionals such as myself).
On the other hand how much all of the above, will be of importance for you, in order to justify an update from an F2 to an F3, depends on what you use the printer for.
my 5 cents so far before even testing the Form3.
Interesting post Demitris, you mention that you are using the Form 2 for Dentistry-Orthodontics - what resin types do you currently use?
It seems all of the Formlabs Dentistry resins will not be available for use with the Form 3 at least for another couple of months yet
From Formlabs own table regarding material availability for use n theForm 3
And no official answer yet from anyone at Formlabs as to if the Form 3 will feature an “Open” mode
I print Dental Models exclusively (So whole arches upper and lower, from intraoral scanner data of each patient), either for Retainers or Aligner Treatments. I have been using the Grey Resin for more than a year and half and the last 4-5 months I am using Dental Model V2. The Model resin looks superior in finishing, however it breaks much more often, especially when removing it from platform (I print on the BP, long before it was an option on Preform).
So basically I was going to use Dental Model V2, from day 1 with Form 3, however I will go back to Grey Resin V4, for the first few months and try again Dental Model V2, once it becomes available.
They should have mentioned during pre-orders about resin and resolution availability (I print 140μm sometimes when I need a model fast…) but they didn’t. So all of us that pre-ordered early, found out about it long after paying and pre-ordering…
My best guess, they run into some kind of issues late during testing the Form 3, so they did not know beforehand… Then again I don’t know it for a fact so…
I guess its no different to buying a new model of a car that no one has reviewed and that you have not been able to see locally, but when it first arrives you find out that you can only drive it in the first two gears until the manufacturer has sorted out the finish of the design (and tested that). I am certain everyone would be happy to accept that and wait around having parted with hard earned cash until the manufacturer actually finishes it.
For a company that was valued last year at $1bn it seems incredible. Its also a new printer being PUSHED to market before another printer that was promised has arrived (Fuse)
Personally I wonder if Formlabs is trying to propagate its own demise through a greedy business model. I like the Form 2, but it does have unresolved issues and quality control on consumables is sometimes hit and miss - that kind of performance can only go on for so long before competitors catch up and a slicker performing company wins out on customer care and quality control
The answer is easy since you mentioned cars…
I have been driving a Form 2 for almost 2 years now professionally producing dental models of patients every single day. And I can tell you it drives as a BMW.
So that is why I am buying a new “car” without it been reviewed… I expect it to “drive” similar if it turns out to be even better then that will be a huge plus!
Formlabs showed so far that it can deliver pro desktop printers at a low price…
I agree except I’ll use the Z06 for my analogy.
My resin cartridge not inserted issues aside, the prints are perfect.
If the Form3 prints better, it’ll be like the long awaited Porsche/Mercedes/BMW/Ferrari killing mid engine C8 ZR1.
Bit late in the day but Simply Rhino had a free Formlabs event with Formlabs yesterday in London at the Goldsmiths Centre.
Got to see the machine (it was not running) but more importantly had a chance to look at F2 vs F3 print quality on clear resin as that was what I was interested in. The edges are much sharper and more “digital” so curved surfaces may seem more stepped. A lot of discussion about the peal strength. It is reportedly 70% lower than the F2. Good news to me as a lot of our parts have membranes of about 110 to 250 microns!. They work on the F2 but we have engineered a work around.
There were two of us at the event that have postponed purchasing because of lack of detailed evidence on the performance. Yes we are both very conservative and were prepared to let the USD500 discount go.
Luckily Simply Rhino (London) will possibly have their demo machine within two weeks and they have invited me to a demo at there site for a performance test,
We design and produce tiny prototypes having M1.6 threads that we just chase out with a m1.6 tap. Our typical wall thickness on our products is in the 300microns range. We do machine these parts regulary on our micro 4 axis cnc machine, but the Form 2 allows us to quickly test a concept in about 15 hours.
I am 80% sold but I am sure will be 100% sold after a couple of trials.
Mark_Harrison has done a brilliant unboxing article. Thanks there.
So if you are London based Joe look up Simply Rhino
Form 3 Unboxing and First Impressions!