Form 3 vs. Form 2 Faceoff!

Good question.

Until you asked, I had not noticed that there was the possibility to import touchpoint sizes. I erroneously thought only touchpoint locations could be imported. So went looking for it. Here’s what I found:

When Preform imports the supports, it does not import touchpoint sizes by default. When you open a *.form file previously saved for printing with a Form 2, an “import support locations” menu appears. The menu explicitly states “Support settings are incompatible”. Hidden under “Show advanced” options, importing touchpoint sizes is possible. To enable that, you click an open box. The menu states importing touchpoint sizes is “Not Recommended”.

The “Show advanced” options also permit you to “Disable internal supports”.

Thanks for the headsup regarding importing touchpoint sizes. I’ll definitely try it since that would be an enormously helpful and time-saving capability.

A few more observations about the printer compared to a Form 2:

  1. The Form 3 touchscreen is larger. Much easier to operate, especially when wearing gloves. Love that.

  2. Before a print cycle, the Form 3’s touchscreen indicates that the optical path is being checked. I’m not sure what that means exactly, but it sure sounds good.

  3. The Form 3 is about the same height and depth as the Form 2 but much wider side-to-side.

  4. The Form 3 resin tank is much bigger than the Form 1/Form 2 LT tank. It has larger handles on the sides making it easier to hold without touching the bottom of the tank.

  5. The orange Form 3 cover’s plastic is thinner than the cover of my Form 2, It has a lighter feel to it.

  6. When a print is complete, the Form 2 touchscreen displays a trashcan for deleting the file from the printer. The Form 3 does not display the trashcan when the print is complete. To delete a file from the Form 3, open the file from the file list on the touchscreen and you can delete the file.

  7. The sounds the Form 3 makes take a little getting used to. A typical print layer cycle produces various mechanical sounds, one of which is quite loud making me erroneously think at first there was something wrong.

  8. Much has been said in other threads about print times. I have not yet run the Form 2 next to the Form 3 with the same model to compare print times. Having said that, Form 3 print times seem reasonable. The sales rep did tell me that the Form 3 was designed for faster printing but presently the software and/or firmware is set to deliberately slow the print cycle. She explained that Formlabs intends to release “throttled up” firmware in the future.

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larsenstephen, thanks for posting your images. It’s the sort of work we are asked to do and we are currently running assorted test parts.

Out of interest, how have you got on with regard to warping or accuracy of straight faces and edges?

I agree that edges seem a little soft.

Straight edge accuracy looks good. None of the models printed so far show any evidence of warping.

{Edit: subsequent prints all exhibit layer shifting and surface bulging. The same models printed on a Form 2 do not have these defects.]

There is a firmware update available today. The next prints will be post-update. Hopefully edges of openings like doors, hatches and portholes will be more precise.

Thanks for the tip! I’ll retry a few prints. Per the 1.4.4 release notes:

Anyone able to elaborate on the refinements and their intended effect?

Im hoping this may help with the terrible layer shifting.

Here are my latest prints…a smal lens and small hollow dome… awful layering/ warping… whatever you want to call it. Been happening in everything i print.

Updated my Form 3’s firmware to the latest 1.4.4 (automatic failed, but manual update worked) and reprinted the cups:

Both of these are from the Form 3. The layer shift ripples are still present. Preform 3.2.2, layer height 50um. I hope we don’t have to wait another month for another firmware update to test :-(.

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Wow. Those prints are deeply worrisome. We’re using standard gray resin and don’t see any layer shifting or warping. Could the problem be specific to certain resins?

{Edit: our Form 3 is experiencing the same kinds of layer shifting and surface bulging on vertical and curved surfaces. FL support reports future firmware updates will address this issue.]

Our Form 3 has begun having WiFi connectivity issues after a week of stable connectivity. Comparatively, our Form 2 has had a stable connection for months. The Form 3 shows that it is on the network with a valid IP address. Preform does not see the Form 3 but does see the Form 2.

After Preform reported the Form 3 had disconnected from WiFi at some point during the night, we rebooted the printer and re-opened Preform. Preform briefly recognized the Form 3 long enough to upload a job but then reported the Form 3 had disconnected again shortly afterwards.

We have found that we can fix the problem by disabling WiFi on the Form 3 touchscreen then re-enabling it. For whatever reason, Preform then sees the Form 3.

Oddly, Preform shows the Form 2 is connected and has stayed connected to the same network the whole time. Both the Form 2 and Form 3 are in the same room but on a different floor than the computer running Preform. The Form 3’s touchscreen reports that it sees the network (and others) and that the signal strength is “good”.

Thoughts?

My Form 2 has dropped the WiFi connection randomly over the last 3 years, and now the Form 3 is acting the same way. I’ve never been able to pin point a cause, but thought it may be interference from other networks, atmospherics or even cosmic rays. In the end I’ve just accepted it as one of the quirks of WiFi.

@rkagerer posted his cup objects (as .form files) in the first post of this thread.
Can you, perhaps, try printing them and see what you get?

I did, in grey, and the warping is there, pretty much at same heights and in the same way he’s getting them.

Those print files are actually mine :smiley: But anyway, just having a little fun in the midst of this extremely annoying prolem.

Yeah I reprinted the lens and the dome with the new firmware and there was no difference whatsoever. As a matter of fact after the update the lens completely failed during one of the prints.

Ah, sorry.
Either way, i’d really like anyone claiming they don’t get warping print them, as it’s geometry-dependent.

I understand, I was just providing some levity :slight_smile:

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Have you tried with the new firmware 3.2.3 from a couple days ago?

I`ve got a print going just now. Fingers crossed.

No not yet… I’ll get it downloading right away

I seem to always discover new firmware/preform releases here in the forums a few days after release by reading some random thread. Does anybody know if there is there a way to get notified?

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Would be helpful.

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According to the firmware release notes the printing improvement is for grey resin at 100 microns .

You mean Preform release notes.

You could always set up a monitoring service to notify you when the Preform release notes or Firmware release notes pages change. I just set up alerts on trackly.io, which watches up to 3 pages for free.

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I really like your usage of the term warping to describe what’s happening here. I think that’s a much better descriptor than layer shift, as shift implies a discrete, but permanent change in x/y position. In all the examples I have seen, the artifacts appear to be regions of distortion or potentially erosion, but often times the outer bounds of the part are congruous, and usually the print continues on without indicating a true loss of position. It also usually seems to happen for at least several layers at a time before returning to normal, so it affects more than one layer before subsiding.

“Warping” does seem to be a better description.